Bono’s call to “Coexist”
December 21, 2005
I use to read Relevant Magazine, but after awhile, I just got tired of many articles that seemed to be saying the same things, and honestly, got a little tired of the pretty conservative theology of the magazine. I ran across a post on Doug’s blog (here) about an article that was included in the 12/19 850 Words of Relevant written by Tara Leigh Cobble (picture on left) entitled “How to Dismantle an Idolized Bono” (the article is actually available on Tara’s message board on her website here and it is also being discussed on this Relevant message board).
In the article, Tara was critiquing the current Christian idolization of Bono (which is a good thing I think), but had major problems with his apparent universalism. First of all, Bono was sporting a headband with the Coexist logo on it (apparently, there is a clothing company that came up with the logo). She quotes Bono as beginning to lead the crowd (at a Madison Square Garden performance) in the mantra of…”Jesus, Jew, Mohammed, all true. Jesus, Jew, Mohammed, all true.” I listened to the Relevant podcast, where Relevant staffers were discussing the article, and it was made clear by emails they were reading from readers that from the very beginning, Tara’s article is flawed because that was simply a misquote of Bono. Apparently he was saying, “Jesus, Jew, Mohammed, it’s true…all sons of Abraham.” And Bono’s call to co-existance was more of a plea for the people of the world’s 3 major religions to stop killing each other, instead of a call to radical universalism.
It was a pretty disturbing experience for Tara, as you can see from this quote below:
Tags: Bono, Coexist, Theology, U2, Universalism“When he stated that lie so boldly, it devastated me. It was, without question, the most disturbing experience of my life; I felt like I’d been covered in bile. As I looked around, I saw all the people standing and chanting with him-it was disgusting and beautiful all at once. Unity can be so enticing. It made me think of the one world religion and how that will probably look benign and beautiful from the outside, too. I even started to wonder if universalism just might be poised to be that religion. All these things were running through my head.
After the show, I ran into a friend who had been sitting in the back row. “What did you think of that headband thing?” I asked. “Well, I couldn’t hear what he was saying because it was bouncing off the wall behind me, and I couldn’t read the headband, because I wasn’t near a JumboTron. But honestly, I felt like I was witnessing an antichrist.” I stood frozen as she spoke. I’d had the same feeling.”
Posted in Theology
Adam Walker Cleaveland: 
December 21st, 2005 at 9:16 am
When I went to the Atlanta show last month, I ‘got it’ that the main thrust there was not that all of the religions were equally true (and let’s give Bono a little credit, he’s smart enough to know that isn’t even possible) but that we are all sons of Abraham. The only worry I had at the time was that lots of folks would misunderstand him, both believers and non-believers.
I think there is a danger in that, but what it really comes back to is the idolization of Bono. If we don’t lift him higher than he should be lifted, these words won’t have near the affect. It’s interesting, Christians are constantly looking for a hero. And we do it whether we are extremely conservative, moderate, progressive, liberal or whatever label you want. It’s a good time of the year to remember that our Messiah has come and is coming.
Anyway, those are my thoughts on the whole thing. I read Doug’s blog yesterday too and was going to comment over at mine. I’m just as satified to do it here. :)
Rich
December 21st, 2005 at 9:31 am
Despite being a pretty solid U2 fan, the idolization of Bono is wearing pretty thin for me. At the U2 show in Seattle that I was at, the crowd in the “bomb shelter” were pretty wooden (or “really laid back” if you want to be kinder) - like they were wondering when Starbucks was going to open…
I didn’t care for the preachy Bono segment in the middle - it had a too carefully rehearsed vibe to it (a bit like an over-impassioned TV evangelist with the fake sweat, etc…) and it came off, well, preachy.
OTOH, the kind of over-reaction described above to misheard words is just moronic. They do themselves no favors, nor gain any credibility outside their narrow audience, as “journalists”.
December 21st, 2005 at 2:13 pm
I think your post raises a good question Adam, which is to say how have we in the Christian community (evangelical or otherwise) made an idol out of Bono? I think Tara’s comments really speak for themselves on this matter. Even your (and other’s) distaste for Bono’s popularity speaks to this issue.
And on this issue I think we ought to let Bono speak for himself. Here’s a link to a track entitled “Get Up Off Your Knees” from a bootleg album by the same name -
http://catcyouth.blogs.com/ninjas_rule/Music/Get_Up_Off_Your_Knees.mp3
See I don’t think it really matters all that much if Bono is orthodox or if indeed he’s a radical universalist. In fact, I don’t think he gives a damn. He’s said so himself time and again, that he doesn’t even belong to a Christian community because he’s never found a church he could worship in. This might be a symptom of Bono’s “thin ecclesiology” (Christianity Today) but I think it’s really a reflection of his deep desire to provoke Christians to action, unapologetically.
And I say this as someone who gets chills every time I hear U2 perform “40″ or hear Bono speak of God’s ineffable love before tens of thousands. I am as guilty as anybody of idolizing him. What his fame confronts in me and what it ought to confront in all Christians is our incessant need to find a icon that will somehow leverage cultural credibility, and give us a seat at the table once again. What I hear Bono doing is challenging each of us to abandon this idolatry in every respect and instead let our lives speak - to get up off our knees and act in Christ’s name.
December 21st, 2005 at 2:30 pm
Adam, thanks for clarifying. Like Doug, I’m not really a Bono “fan” by any means, but I’m glad to know that there was a part that Tara was leaving out which makes all the difference.
Peace,
Eric
December 21st, 2005 at 4:51 pm
this is how i responded on the message boards to people concerned with an “idolized” bono who seems, to them, to be universalist:
it looks like you have two arguments here. i’ll help you get organized.
your arguments seem to be that
A) People are idolizing Bono. this argument is probably tied to the 10 Commandments command to not make any graven images, or have any other gods before YHWH. and,
B) Bono’s message which he calls “COEXIST” has a “negative effect” because it leads people to believe that religions other than Christianity are also true.
now that we have our ducks in a row, let’s take a closer look. regarding the first argument, does anyone really think that people see Bono as a divine being who is worshipped in a way that competes with their worship of the God of the Universe? i’ve met both Bono and the God of the Universe, and it’s silly to suggest that there is an ontological similarity between the two; no, rather, Bono has simply taught me more about God. and that’s not a bad thing.
on the second argument… let’s get practical with that one. i, for example, am good friends with a Jewish rabbi and a Muslim imam. they both have thriving congregations in my town. I’ll outline two ways to approach my relationship with them, the first will be your type of reasoning and the second will be one of coexistence.
1. my friend (the rabbi) and i talk often about the differences in Judaic and Christian world views, particularly about our ideas of sin and atonement. we enjoy dialoguing and even teach a class together which is open to both our congregations. it’s about the book of Isaiah, a book which we share as sacred scripture but have different interpretations. the Truth of Jesus Christ, for me, is compelling, absolute, and the single most important source of joy and life. and my friend the rabbi knows this about me. concurrently, his faith is the most central aspect of his life, obviously–he’s a rabbi! we respect each other and, um, coexist in a peaceful, loving relationship.
2. let’s say we took the advice of people who are deeply afraid of Bono’s suggestion. what would my relationship with the rabbi and imam look like? i suppose i would often remind the rabbi that my half of our conversations contains the only thoughts that are actually True, and that he should get ready for an afterlife in the eternal flames of hell. this wouldn’t make for a very healthy relationship, would it. and if he ended each conversation with a reminder that, no, it was actually he who held the Truth in what he said, and that i am going to spend my afterlife in despair in the pit of hell. this would be neither peaceful nor loving. now let’s say it wasn’t me and the rabbi, but rather two nations. these two nations didn’t even dialogue about their differences, but stubbornly held that theirs was the only Truth and that, hey, since the other nation is wrong anyway, they should probably be bombed so we can spread our religion there when the smoke clears.
the one scenario brings peace; the other scenario brings war.
Bono is right: coexistence among people of all faiths is a good goal.
December 21st, 2005 at 6:35 pm
This is why I tire of “postmoderns.” RELEVANT Magazine may not be perfect in terms of theology, but i think that is the point. It provides an excellent forum for discussion among young people, something that postmoderns say they want. But here it is, and it’s not good enough. It’s too conservative. Go ahead and keep shutting out opportunities instead of taking them.
December 21st, 2005 at 9:19 pm
This post was featured on SmartChristian.com
December 22nd, 2005 at 10:53 am
I was at the U2 concert here in Miami this past month and we didn’t do the chant thing, but he did do the headband and put coexist all over the screens & curtains. I never once felt like he was saying anything except to be respectful of all people - whether we agree with them or not.
He finished the main part of the show with Yahweh - with very, very Christian images played all around him on the screens. I guess if you got upset and left, then you would have missed that.
I have videos of most of Yahweh, as well as a bunch of other parts of the show if anyone is interested… not great quality and not long clips (I took them on my phone).
December 22nd, 2005 at 1:44 pm
I’m not sure what to think about the Bono issue, but I just visited Tara Leigh Cobble’s site, which has a “stand up and do something” section in her links….the first one being to the NRA. Strange.
December 22nd, 2005 at 2:27 pm
Very interesting — maybe we could get Tara over here to pomomusings to explain the NRA link. Hmm…
December 22nd, 2005 at 4:00 pm
I tend to agree with the originator of the article critiqueing the idolization of Bono. I have seen this for many years and have always been quite warry of it. I am not a big U2 fan, but I don’t mind their music. Bono seems to be the posterchild for many postmodern Christian movements…not sure how good of an idea that is.
December 22nd, 2005 at 9:10 pm
I can see why Christians would really have an issue with Bono having anything close to saying you should ‘co exist’ with Jews.
As an example lets look at the last 100 years of Christian witness to us jewish people.
You kill us at least one third of the ones you can get your hands on, torture us with grusome medical experiments ( all the better to show us the love of Jesus I guess) and then when its over and we find a tiny scrap of land given by the UN support suicide bombers with whatever money you can raise to finish the job on those who managed to crawl out of the camps offspring.
Wonderful.
I can see why mainstream Christians hate Bono.
Why not just keep on killing Jews the way you have for centuries?
Isn’t that REALLY the Cchristian way?
And don’t try to BS me, history speaks very very well for itself.
Why are you all so against the separation wall?
Oh yes! It saves Jewish lives.
Look in the mirror.
Its pretty sad to see.
The girl in question is pretty on the outside, but the anti semeitic message is Hitler all over again.
December 22nd, 2005 at 9:11 pm
I can see why Christians would really have an issue with Bono having anything close to saying you should ‘co exist’ with Jews.
As an example lets look at the last 100 years of Christian witness to us jewish people.
You kill us at least one third of the ones you can get your hands on, torture us with grusome medical experiments ( all the better to show us the love of Jesus I guess) and then when its over and we find a tiny scrap of land given by the UN support suicide bombers with whatever money you can raise to finish the job on those who managed to crawl out of the camps offspring.
Wonderful.
I can see why mainstream Christians hate Bono.
Why not just keep on killing Jews the way you have for centuries?
Isn’t that REALLY the Cchristian way?
And don’t try to BS me, history speaks very very well for itself.
Why are you all so against the separation wall?
Oh yes! It saves Jewish lives.
Look in the mirror.
Its pretty sad to see.
The girl in question is pretty on the outside, but the anti semeitic message is Hitler all over again.
December 23rd, 2005 at 12:54 am
We needed some other voices in here. Thanks for your contribution, Callie.
One correction: mainstream Christians do not hate Bono. These are the voices of conservative or evangelical Christians. At least get the target of your tirade right. Some of us DO actually agree with you.
December 23rd, 2005 at 9:29 am
fmw,
I guess I did get a bit fired up by that woman’s attack on Bono!
Its just a true charector flaw of mine to start scolding beofre I have a chance to think.
Sorry I mistook you for agreeing with her.
I just think with debt relief in Africa, his work on AIDS and his efforts toward coexitance he has done a great job with his fame.
So this woman who doesn’t like him is an evangelical? The Christain left likes him but the right doesn’t?
Its hard for an outsider to understand the politics of Christians.
December 23rd, 2005 at 11:25 am
My goodness.
I love the train of thought that says “Question authority, question the government, question God, call out the president, call out the pope, call out the NRA, call out the ‘Evangelicals’ (now a derogatory term), and question anything that comes out of the Bible, but man, DO NOT question a rock star.”
That article did not do anything to blaspheme the name of the Mighty Bono, or to call into question his good works in Africa or anywhere else. It was about one statement he supposedly made at a concert. A statement that - and I think any Christian would agree - was wrong and misled, if it was quoted correctly.
You know, I liked Bono before all this hoopla got started, but now that I see what a blind and worshipful following he has, I’m starting to dislike him on general principle.
December 23rd, 2005 at 12:39 pm
Here is a response to the Relevant article by Steve Stockman. Stockman is the author of “Walk On” which chronicles the spiritual life of U2. Ironically, the book was published by none other than Relevant Books. Seems like those at Relevant need to huddle up and figure out what their view of Bono actually is.
http://www.stocki.ni.org/news/items/item-635.phtml
December 23rd, 2005 at 4:05 pm
Callie said: “The Christain left likes him but the right doesn’t? Its hard for an outsider to understand the politics of Christians.”
The line doesn’t divide that evenly. Most evangelicals I know admire Bono, and many liberals I know have no idea who he is. Tara Leigh said some things about him … but she’s not a theologian and she’s certainly not a spokesperson for evangelicals. She’s a musician and that’s about it.
Actually, you would be hard-pressed to find a “christian” that fits the caricature you drew above, but remember that evangelicals are outspokenly pro-Israel and unlikely to be anti-semitic. Liberal Christians, though not typically anti-semitic, tend to side with Palestine politically, for some reason. These are generalities; there are exceptions. Odd thing about Christians: you have to deal with them as individuals.
December 23rd, 2005 at 9:55 pm
Steve,
I agree that one must take people as unique individuals.
I am struck by the comment before yours and think it to be fairly typical of Christian theology ( please correct me if I am wrong!) in which Bono’s efforts to save the lives of those with AIDS and to attempt to right the terrible poverty in Africa do not matter to many Christians since he is leaving the central idea that ONLY Christians have a religion that is valid.
This idea that people who do not believe in your faith are doomed to suffer in hell is pretty unique amoung world religions.
Judaism has no similiar world view so its hard for us Jews to fathom this idea so central to Christians and their world view.
For us, each person has his or her own calling, hence there is no need to evangilize others to Judaism to ’save’ them from something .
People are urged to study, be loyal to family, and to help others and be kind to animals.
We believe that those of other faithes who are good people have the same rights to an afterlife as anyone. Its called The Noahite Laws.
Merry Christmas to you.
Thanks for informing me of what is really true. Its hard to keep track of it.
Also, thanks to Adam for encouraging dialogue and conversation on these matters.
I don’t see why Christians focus more on converting others than on helping people who are already Christians practice their faith.
It seems so odd to me.
December 23rd, 2005 at 11:22 pm
Callie, your points are well made. There’s an unfortunate gap between Christian theology and the behavior of the most visible Christians. I know many Christians who are radically committed to serving the poor, but these aren’t the ones making headlines. Instead, it’s guys like Pat Robertson and those who get mad when people say, “Happy Holidays.” Christians who are truly interested in doing the work of Jesus not only support the type of work Bono is doing, but are doing it themselves on some level. The rest is just religious talk, and you are right to see through it.
December 24th, 2005 at 10:46 am
Steve,
I agree many Christians do great things. As much as I am troubled by those like Pat O’Reilly and Robertson’s call to create an intolerant Christian America I know that is not the view of most people.
We in the Jewish community have our share of bad examples too, such as those war mongers in the Bush Administration. They make me cringe.
Do you know of any good books for an outsider to Christianity to read to learn more about it? I would like to understand it better.
You might be interested in the following, it gives info on the concerns we as Jews have about the Christian right.
http://www.adl.org/media_watch/newspapers/20051129-WSJ.htm
December 26th, 2005 at 11:02 am
2cents,
Merry Christmas to you and your family.
Actually, no the ADL objected to the images of Jews as responsible for the death of Christ.
They never predicted pograms.
What they did do was ask that negative stereotypes not be used and for dialogue.
I have no problem with that. The ADL was very misrepresented in the Christian press.
Why not check out what they have to say for themselves instead of going on fiction?
http://www.adl.org
May you have all the blessings of the season.
December 26th, 2005 at 11:09 am
2 cents,
Here from the ADL, you can see for yourself what the issue was.
Mel Gibson has stated that many people are calling him an anti-Semite. What is ADL’s position?
A. ADL and its representatives have never accused Mr. Gibson of being an anti-Semite. We do not know what is in his heart. We only know what he has put on the movie screen. The images there show Romans who behave with compassion toward Jesus. The Roman governor, Pontius Pilate, constantly expresses his reticence to harm Jesus. The Jews, on the other hand, are depicted as blood-thirsty. The Jewish High Priest, Caiaphas, is shown as bullying Pilate, and the hundreds and hundreds of amassed Jews demanding Jesus’ death.
Q. Is the film faithful to the Bible and accepted Christian teachings?
A. The script is based upon the Synoptic Gospels (Matthew, Mark and Luke) and John. But in order to weave together the story, these different texts must be harmonized and holes in the story must be filled in. The Biblical text tries to project a story of faith, but some of the narratives also reflect the growing schism between the Church and the Jewish people. Modern scholars have taught that the Gospel narratives must be taught responsibly. Since the Second Vatican Council of the early 1960’s the Catholic Church has taught that the Jews of Jesus’ time, as well as the Jews of today cannot be held responsible for the death of Jesus.
Q. Are Jewish fears about the film exaggerated? After all, it is only a movie.
A. It has been said that Mr. Gibson’s film represents the greatest tool for evangelization that has ever existed. Indeed, more people will see this film than all the Passion Plays from the Middle Ages to today. It is not just the film in movie theatres that has raised our concern, but the market for DVD copies (no doubt with additional footage and deleted scenes). These will be shown in youth gatherings, religious schools and other places without regard to modern scholarship and teachings. Further, we are concerned about the film’s impact in Europe, South America and the Middle East, places where anti-Semitism already exists.
As anti-Semitism increases around the globe, many are using the age-old deicide charge to legitimize and foment hatred against Jews. Our concerns have already become an excuse for an outpouring of anti-Semitism. Since going public with our concerns about the film, ADL and other Jewish organizations have been flooded with hate-filled e-mails, letters and phone calls.
Q. Have you tried to discuss this with Mel Gibson?
A. We have repeatedly tried to reach out to discuss this with Mr. Gibson and Icon Productions, without success.
December 27th, 2005 at 7:18 am
God forbid us Conservative Christians for beliveing what Jesus said he meant. Is Progressive Christian another code word for Universalism. When I lived in Turkey-doing the unmentionable- encouraging Muslim to follow Jesus- which actually happened, the new followers of Jesus found freedom and joy in the exclusive sayings of Jesus, not easy for them with the consequences of their new faith in Jesus. A partially true Jesus, saves no one, comforts no one, encourages no one, ministers no one because Jesus is behind everything we see and the world was made through Him.
Good Blog. I like your thoughts and insights though I would not always agree. It is good to read and see where other people are coming from.
Thanks
Tim
December 27th, 2005 at 11:59 am
Interesting article.
I agree with alot of it, and believe his ideas are well thought out.
I put a comment on the post ‘annoying’ that I think explains alot of present day jewish fear of Christians.
Did you see it 2cents? I wonder what you would say.
I agree with your article on this point very much btw:
It is a pity that, in the eyes of our congregation, the most serious moral message we have to impart has nothing to do with the Torah or with God. It’s about a generalized paranoia, an ingrained habit of issuing mistaken alarms about phantom anti-Semitism, and then to deny we ever made a mistake
December 27th, 2005 at 7:47 pm
Adam,
You mentioned that you are a bit tired of reading Relevant due to its conservative theology. I wonder if, for similar reasons, you will tire of reading the comments on your own blog?
Dave
December 27th, 2005 at 10:31 pm
People leave comments?
December 27th, 2005 at 11:27 pm
You’re my hero
December 28th, 2005 at 1:57 pm
Dave,
If Adam is your hero then doesn’t it trouble somewhat as a Christian that he refers in his Christmas post link to the Jewish people as a ‘Zionist Entity’? This is deeply painful to read to those of us of the Jewish faith. What about his references to suicide bombers as ‘resistance’?
Even this is acceptable to mainstream Christians? If so, I do not fear Jesus, but only as G-d to shelter us from his followers.
Thanks you and all the best wishes for the season.
December 28th, 2005 at 6:45 pm
A Jew to Dave,
My comment, “You are my hero,” was localized to Adam’s response to my somewhat sarcastic and tongue in cheek comment. I took his response as joining the spirit of my comments. Hence, he was, in that response, my hero. Beyond that, I don’t know Adam well enough for him to be my hero. Although, I have valued his thoughts and his support.
Dave
December 29th, 2005 at 12:45 am
Dave,
Many thanks for your reply.
I must ask you, as a Christian are you at all offended by the author of this blog refering to the Jewish people in his Christmas link as a ‘Zionist Entity”?
Or how about refering to those who target innocent civilians as ‘freedom fighters’?
I am in favor of a homeland for Palestinians but am troubled by the Christians who support violent radical voices.
Don’t Christians find it hypocritical that someone who will be part of the clerfy is in favor of violence against innocent people?
Why do only Jewish people as this question on this blog? Isn’t Christianity even trying to be about peace anymore? Doesn’t anyone at Princeton read the “Do not kill” commandment or is that not post modern enough these days?
Again, I thank you for your reply. We are wondering if you might explain these things to us.
December 29th, 2005 at 1:30 am
A Jew To Dave,
I would rather my response here be my own response rather than an attempt to editorialize what Adam, or anyone else for that matter, meant in a particular post.
First, I sense your very frustrated by all of this. It seems to me, your questions, in your last post, are similar to the one I posed that got this whole thing started. Your questions seem to have an agenda behind them. This is not all bad. I had an agenda behind my question. My agenda, to state it plainly, was: good grief, I can’t believe how much virtual space is being taken up by this bono thing…it reminds me why I am no longer comfortable with the evangelical label.
Perhaps I should have just said that.
To be fair, I went back and read all the posts again and now feel like my original question was aimed at certain responses rather than the entire set of responses.
So it seems to me (and only me) that your questions are really more convictions you already hold about your frustrations with some Christians and their view of the Jewish/Palestinian issue. Beyond this, it seems that you are frustrated, in general, with the Christian perspective on the Jewish experience.
How’s all that for a set up to some kind of answer. So…
I believe the root of your frustrations with Christians is really due to a deeper problem–a human problem. It is the problem of fundamentialism. Whenever an individual or group or faith community or faith tradition believes it has the essence of absolute truth, above and beyond all others, that person or community is in danger of destructive prejudices that will lead to all sorts of evil–no matter what form that evil takes.
This fundamentalism is evident in my faith tradition as well as yours as well as every other. It is, in part, responsible for the hatred in the world, wars, prejudices of all kinds and a general arrogance that I/WE (whoever that might be) are superior to YOU/THEY (whoever you or they might be). Once I’ve crossed this line and adopted this attitude, I am a breath away from labeling and condeming the world to hell or some other punishment that seems fitting–like flying planes into buildings or starting wars “in the name of God.”
So…this attitude justifies all sorts of dynamics I believe you are frustrated about. However, this is not exclusively something that Christians struggle with; it is a human woe. We all struggle with it.
I believe some Jews and some Palestinians alike (but by no means all Jews or all Arabs) struggle with the insidious nature of fundamentalism AND it is part of why the struggle continues. Simply, some in each group believes only their group is RIGHT. Some Christians, some Muslims, some Hindus also struggle with this. Although, I don’t know if I’ve ever met a Buddhist fundamentalist :)….interesting.
So…the surface frusrtations you have, to me, spring from this deeper problem. A problem we all must own if we are ever to change it.
dave
December 29th, 2005 at 9:17 am
Dave,
Yes this is a long thread indeed.
You make an amazing point that fundamentalism can dehumanize people.
I agree completely.
What I object to is not the blog author ( or anyone’s ) critism of Israel. Many times I myself don’t agree with them! As we see all too well in the US people in times of crisis make mistakes. Israel has made many.
What I find so repugnant is to demonize and dehumanize an entire people. To use the language of hamas and refer to Jews as a “zionist entity’ is offensive. Also, its not helpful to building common ground between people any more than other ethnic slurs are.
Also, to refer to suicide bombers as ‘freedom fighters’ implies that blowing up little girls at pizza parlors is the right thing. Linking to such a site implies agreement. This one would think is against the ideals of Jesus.
Everyone deserves a home and to live in peace. Both Jews and Arabs need this.
Christians on the left who belittle Jews are no different than those on the right who disdain Muslims.
In my own opinion, it is unseemly for one who aspires to the clergy to use such ofensive language against any faith group or nation.
And this is where those like Adam Cleveland someone (who is no doubt well intentioned) start to sound like the far right.
My thanks and all the blessings of the season to you and your family. Also, to the blog owner, our appreciation for hosting this thread.
January 1st, 2006 at 11:07 am
Speaking of fundamentalism, it seems to be the left’s trying to stop the checkpoints in Isreal is a good example:
from Haaretz today:
The Islamic Jihad militant group claimed responsibility Friday for a suicide bombing in the West Bank that killed one soldier and two other Palestinians.
Islamic Jihad activists in the West Bank village of Atil, near Tul Karm, announced on loudspeakers that their bomber, Sohieb Ibrahim Yassin, 19, carried out Thursday’s attack.
Army sources said the suicide bomber who killed an Israel Defense Forces officer and two Palestinians at an army checkpoint near Tul Karm Thursday was apparently planning to blow himself up at one of the many children’s events taking place in Tel Aviv during this week’s Hanukkah holiday.
Had the bomber not been stopped at the checkpoint, the attack would have been far more deadly.
January 18th, 2006 at 3:57 pm
So, what makes Relevant too conservative? That they insist that Christ is the only way, that they seem to have a theology, or that they just misunderstood Bono?
It doesn’t take a particularly strong religious consciousness…really, any religious consciousness at all…to see groups killing one another on the basis of differences as a bad thing. Nor does it take a commitment to doctrine to see groups killing one another as a good thing.
What we need is more and better theology and not less. The teachings of Christ are pretty clear and don’t need to be pomoized for the sake of a bland, predictable coolness.
April 5th, 2007 at 12:14 pm
Oh no, Tara wasn’t lying - I attended 12 shows as an observer-protester-reporter and artist myself. At a number of those shows, how Tara quoted Bono WAS essentially THE SAME as what he said - the message was the same: BLASPHEMY of God; the DEMOTION of Jesus Christ; the ripping down of the idea of God Almighty having a standard of ONE TRUTH about himself and his terms of worship that he requires of human beings, and, along with that, the idea that there IS only one true global religion of that truth.
Through the course of that tour, I eyewitnessed mass spiritual suicide or at least the taking-in of spiritually fatal death disease - by a cult leader, using the hooks of sensuality and supposed biblical trueness (due to scattered scriptural references and allusions - including incorrect ones, however, in some songs). First the brainwashing: “But I still haven’t found what I’m looking for”, led and chanted by tens of thousands. This, along with other de-programming and re-programming: “The Fly” screen messages, which included such mentally-spiritually manipulative spirtual lie suggestions. The lie suggestions throughout the concert, set to great music, of course, exercised their capability to go right through the heart and mind defenses of most present - resulting in many so-called “Christians” clapping and cheering for a man and his band - even though that man just ripped down biblical truth; re-Judasized, re-Pilotized, called for the spiritual re-impalement afresh of their Lord before them (reminiscent of those who once hyped-up “we have no king but Caesar”, and the lot who preach and live, “Let us ‘render sacred service to the creation rather than the one who created’, Romans 1:25); blasphemed the personal holy name of God Almighty; promoted false religion; promoted worship of the Revelation 13 “beast”; and promoted idolatry of the “image of the beast” (additionally blaspheming God by singing “Hallelujah” to a scroll created by it - which further on contains an idolatry clause); serving up, by all of these things, the mark of the beast to his adoring crowds - to all that wanted to take it in, slap it on their foreheads, sign up for it, love it, cheer for it, die forever for it.